I've read so many blogs lately praising Chameleon, I almost feel like we should give it a little hill of it's own. It's a decent product, it's not a miracle worker. People coming to the shelter, looking for their lost pets are the answer to reuniting pets and owners. How did it become the shelter's responsibility to " bring your dog home" it's your dog, come get it. Next we can start an Amber Alert on the interstates. A woman came in today with a truckload of grief for volunteers and staff alike over her lost dog. Seems the dog went missing 4 days ago, and we had it. Yes indeedy, we dognapped it. The dog was on petfinder for 3 days and nobody came calling, so the dog was offered for adoption. Nice dog, found a home quickly, and was in the spay clinic, getting ready for it's new family when the irate owner finally got off her couch and came down to the shelter. If she had done that sooner she would have claimed her dog the next day. The pet in question was mix, and we try to guess as closely as we can. Our thought was Chow/Lab mix so into the database it went, she felt the dog was Golden Ret/Collie mix. Well you know petfinder has thousands of animals, so she narrowed her search by breed. A learned reader can guess the ending. Pictures are only as good as the people looking for them. Nothing replaces the trip to the shelter.
There are people who do use the web to search for a pet to adopt, I have mixed feelings about that too. A pet is a long commitment, if you don't care enough to come down and meet all the critters eye to eye, you may not have what it takes to be a good owner. Adopting a pet for looks is like marrying for looks. I hope that caused some squirming:) Also from the shelter standpoint it's impossible to get every animal into and out of the data base in a timely manner. People come down to look at a dog that got adopted two days ago, drove in from Stockton, they are hostile. Should the picture have been pulled, sure, is there always time for immediate updating ? Nope.
I know there are advantages to posting online, but it should be only one tool in the box of many. Nothing will ever replace personally looking for the animal in your life, whether adopting or reclaiming. There are no shortcuts to happy ending's. Washoe tried the shuttle service and it was a failure all the way around, it breeds complacancy in the owners of at large dogs and rewards the careless owner. A lost pet belongs at the shelter where a caring owner will come to reclaim it.
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I agree completely here. I don't like PetFinders at all. I have never found it "shelter user" friendly. I much prefer PetHarbor when you are looking for a lost pet. At one time, I do know that two shelters, close by each other, had a special unit so if you were at one and didn't find either a lost pet or one for adoption, you could look at the pets in the other shelter which was about a 20 minute drive away. Worked really well. These types of units should be in each library so those without a computer could be directed to a nearby library.
I still prefer people coming to the shelter because breed is in the eyes of the beholder. Some shelters have a "found" book in the lobby for those folks who have found a pet but are retaining it trying to find an owner. Again you need to go into the shelter to check this book. I post my found pets in all the local shelters. Those shelters with a found book also have a lost book you can register your lost pet in. At the end of the day, the staff will take the lost book into the kennels and try to match up for any pets impounded that day. Remember your pet may not be picked up the same day it disappears. This is a continuing process.
@HH you brought up some excellent points and ideas. (a couple I forgot to mention :) The breed is in the eye of the beholder is an outstanding statement.
Good conversation for us. I am receiving a lot of pressure to put our animals on the web, the very things mentioned here are what worries me. What if a dog is listed, suddenly becomes aggressive, and needs to be put down ? With our winters it could be a convenience to some of our senior citizens, but they would still have to come out to get the dog. My thought straight up is, will it do more harm than good? We are getting a lot of pitbulls, they look handsome in the picture even if they're mean. I don't want a bunch of do-gooders yelling about some dog I can't get near. I did go visit that YesBiscuit site. Those old women are nuts, and with the internet they are right in everybody's business.
Welcome back Chap, I thought you died :) We put our own pictures on our own website. Less "looky lou's " It allows us to interact more quickly as changes occur in the shelter. As Jesse said, a dog can turn around quickly either way, we are all happy to post the happy turn arounds, but the ones where the dog goes south nah !
Yes, Spouse, I live. I do like your website and it does keep people in your area focused. Sometimes with Petfinder they lose track of where they saw the dog and you get calls for other shelters.
I have to throw this in while we are on the subject of pictures online. California shelters are required to prove ownership from anyone claiming a pet from the shelter as theirs. This can be done with license records, vet records, or pictures.
Pictures can be altered these days easily by anyone (except me). Many shelters won't allow cameras because of the taking of pictures of owned pets and pets are considered owned until the end of their holding time.
So pictures can be an enemy. I would like to see something on Petfinders and Petharbor where there is an insert that cannot be altered across the face of the pet. I know it is hard to believe but this can and does happen.
Jesse, there's no easy answer for you. You just have to believe in yourself about determining the adoptability of a dog or not. Then you have to stand by your convictions. If you chose not to post their pictures, then they will come down on you for that. It is a damn if you do and damn if you don't situation that you present. Wish the news were better.
In Memphis there were accusations of dog theft from MAS. It didn't seem true to me, with so many pitbulls running the streets. Just set a dish of food on the front porch and you have all the pitbulls you want. Friends puts pictures on FB and that allows peole to ask about the dog and stuff you can't do with Petfinder or Chameleon. We get so many dogs that aren't adoptable to the average family, there is no point in putting them on the internet. Like Jess said above, it's just asking for trouble. If those women ever come calling in your neighborhood, don't offer them a sweet tea. The City of Memphis should never have tried to deal with them. You can't work with a zealot.
I'll remember that too SB. People who have all the answers should start testing them in their own shelter, these people want to test on another shelter. Let the Big Biscuit start in SC.
In Sac we do receive many animals that have no hope and the only answer is euthanasia after the hold period. The condition many of them arrive in would probably make us accessories to cruelty if we returned them. We get many pit types that are 20 pounds underweight, dragging a limb, often broken ribs. That dog is not going to rehome, and it shouldn't "go home" if that's what home is. I believe many do not come looking for the dog because they know they would have some serious questions to answer.
There was a time several years ago when almost all of the strays at MAS were posted on a Webshots site, and it made life easier for me as someone who does breed-specific rescue. I could peruse the site at my convenience every day or two for my breed and know whether I needed to go in person to check a dog out as a potential rescue candidate.
Back then there were people in far-away places who would decide they had to save some specific dog they saw on the site, and there was a local group who would assist with this process. That group sometimes got stuck with dogs they'd pulled for these out-of-state folks. We didn't endure as many Internet zealots back then, even during the 2004ish edition of "MAS is evil", but my group did have to deal with a few. Dealing with those zealots is what led to our policy of not pulling dogs for any out of area rescue. For some reason out-of-state zealots tend to not be very good at paying their bills and following through on their commitments.
Honesty is so right about the risk of people being able to alter photographs from shelters to make a case for ownership of a particular dog. I suspect that most people in favor of posting photos online don't really consider that possibility, or if they do, they are only thinking about the stray mixed breed or pitbull that isn't likely to be in high demand. But what if the photo is of a high dollar dog like a Cavalier King Charles Spaniel? Someone who can't afford to buy one might just be motivated to claim the stray one in the shelter as their own.
My objection to the "free ride home" concept is along the same lines. Say the ACO picks up a black lab mix and asks passers-by if they recognize the dog... it's unlikely anyone would make a false claim of ownership in that case. But what if the ACO has just picked up a stray yorkie? The chances are much greater that a passer-by would falsely identify someone as the owner. "Oh yeah, that's Mary Sue's dog. She's at work right now, but she lives in that blue house. You can just put the dog back in her fenced yard, and he'll be fine til she gets home."
Is there a happy medium? I do miss being able to check out the dogs online when I don't have time to visit. Watermarking the photos sounds like a good way to go, but how much time would that add to the posting process?
@ Suburbangirl I asked Oreo on the "watermark " . She can take one out in about 3 minutes. The only protection for online images is to keep them at about 100 pixels. those cannot be enlarged enough to have any value. I am not getting all this straight. I will have her come on here and post.
SG, I hear people complaining about the bad pictures that shelters make of their residents but a bad picture would be discouraging for altering. People might question why the pet looked scared or matted. So bad pictures aren't as bad as they are made out to be actually when you consider the scenarios.
Hi Chap, hope this works, I've locked myself out of my account, again. I cruise nearby shelters for my GSD's. With the price of gas and the hours I am working I can't always get there when they are open. As a rescue the webshots are handy for me. That said, following both you and Oreo on the Memphis mess has changed my expectations.If Kent was under cyberstalker fire I would be sympathetic . I have received alerts for GSD's and when I looked online they had 4 white feet and a blaze. Pictures have saved me many trips, but I don't want them to be a draw for the NKNJ as Shel calls them. Bottom line from Washington state is, they're convenient but I functioned without them before, could do it again. Most shelters are more than happy to call when my breed comes in, they could email me a picture and save a lot of stalker grief. If they couldn't email me a pic, I wouldn't go.
My shelter uses Petfinder, we never answer the phones. Honesty is the best policy. The point I am making is, people have to come to the shelter to "see" a dog or cat. Half the animals on our page are out of date, when people call they expect us to know about an animal we have never seen, that may not be there anymore. I am disillusioned after all the hype the software was given. People are still going to have to come to the shelter, and a picture may draw interest but serious adopters hit the shelter.
@ SuburbanGirl. I agree releasing dogs to anyone without proof of ownership is a bad idea. The other side of the dog being stolen is if the dog is a pain. Most of us have heard stories of neighbors letting neighbors dogs out to shut them up. I also think that pictures could be used in domestic battery cases, say the ex finds the dog and comes down with a dab of proof. He could then use the dog to intimidate the ex. I also had a friend who gave up her pit because her husband beat it so bad. She told him it ran off. Sure he could go to MAS and look, but if he did he would have questions to answer. In her case the dog was pts at once, so then the picture gets put up ? Shirley is the biggest pain, but there are other reasons to have owners come down to the shelter.
Good morning SB, I have another thought to share. When we go to the supermarket, most of the staples are in the back of the store. They want us to walk past the goodies to get to what we came for. True that is an impulse purchase of sorts, but it may also allow us to see something we had forgotten we needed.
Most people really base the adoption on personality. Perhaps if they come down to the shelter looking for one type, say a Shorthair pointer, they may find another hunting dog who catches their eye, having simelar traits. Whereas a series of pictures would have shown no Shorthairs. You can tell I am a "get them into the shelter" person.
I must leap in here. As it's been stated the pictures are beneficial to rescues, and a limited number of owners of lost dogs. Allow me to share with you a typical call, you may decide the benefit to the shelter or the dog.
Greta : Thank you for calling our shelter, how may I help you ?
Citizen : I'm calling about a dog I saw online.
Greta : Do you have the ID number ?
Citizen : No, but it's a black and white dog called Diesel.
Greta : We have several black and white dogs, and 8 dogs named Diesel. Could you provide the # please?
Citizen : I've closed the page, do you want to adopt these dogs or not ?
Greta : We do, but you need to tell me which dog you are calling about so I can help you.
Citizen : You have an accent, then tries Spanish.
Greta : I'm German, I thought you had the accent. Please do not address me in Spanish I speak only German, English, French and Italian.
Citizen : I want to speak to someone who cares about the animals getting adopted.
Greta : Nobody here can help you until you tell us which dog you are asking about.
Citizen : Here, number A78654, is it a boy or girl ?
Greta : Diesel is a boy.
Citizen : How is he with cats ?
Greta : Like many Bully breeds he has a strong prey drive, but for the moment shows little interest in cats. Small dogs are a problem.
Citizen : Yes I see THAT on the website, but have you sat down in a room with a cat on your lap to see how he reacts ?
Citized : Does this breed shed, or has it had any health issues in it's history ?
Greta : All dogs shed, and we have had the dog for 1 week. It came from the street with no ID, we have no history.
Citizen : You don't put much effort into getting these dogs adopted do you?
Greta : Is there anything else I can help you with ?
Citizen : Will this dog be at the adoption @ Petco this Saturday ?
Greta : No, This Petco only allows small breeds for insurance purposes.
Citizen: Another pitbull hater I see.
Greta : Thank you for calling our shelter, we hope you come in and meet Diesel. Have a nice day.
OMG Greta, that is to funny. And I have asked the same stupid questions. You must think " do these people ever read before they call" I always ask the any known history question. I can see how a few of those a day could pull you off task. I really hadn't considered how many inane phone calls staff deals with. I do get them here with the dogs I post on petfinder, but I only have 5 dogs at a time. I also state on my outgoing message " all the information I have on the dog is posted online, please leave your number and I will return your call, we can set up a meeting at that time" If they won't commit to being serious adopters I won't set and chat with them for an hour.
Hey Gret, talked with a friend today who thought you came off as cold. I guess the warped German sense of humor didn't come through. Or maybe one has to go through a couple of hundred of those calls to see the humor:) I suppose those of those who have met you in person are visualizing the twinkle in your eye. To any and all who think the Kraut is not cuddly, ask Velvet, or Pixie, or any of the other animals receiving her caring touch. Lighten up Gret, you're putting folks off :)
I thought you were trying to show that pictures, while nice, are not always the end all, and do not save time or money for the shelter. If people are dealing with a smaller computer literate set of demographics, the use and sucess might be higher. My comparison would be to use any other catalogue service, and get into a dialoge with the person working phones on the other end. I don't call Penny's and ask if that line runs large, the person at the desk doesn't know......Same with a shelter taking 50 animals a day, they don't know. If they do, it's online. I did learn that Petfinder does not record the assigned number to the dogs file in the shelter, so that would take that worker a little longer to find, but I still think that most front desk people don't know. Please don't run with that and start calling the dog manager, they are taking care of dogs.
@ Oreo, point taken. Gret, I thought you were funny, but to a stranger it could sound smart aleck. We know you are not sarcastic, but that wry sense of humor could fool a newbie.
The general public needs to learn a little more about a shelter if they are going to shop there. It's not Macy's and you can't try a dog on, but you can come down and see if it's looks like a fit. Many shelters have quit answering their phones because the calls are so time consuming, so the public should be aware of the limited resources. Here is as good a place to learn as any. I have spent time in Gret's shelter and the phone logs can show 200 calls per day and with 2 volunteers on shift to answer them. The only answer is to turn the phones off in places with no volunteers. I would like to see the actual numbers of people who " find their lost dog" through webshots.
Chap, I have a situation that has come up over the weekend with my local shelter/rescue group. The shelter does not post pictures online. The "main" rescue group does the picture posting on their Facebook page. Here is my question & one of my main beefs with them. How much responsibility should that group take for comments made on their pictures? They sometimes tend toward inflammatory descriptions of pictures. I will try to sum up the latest one.
The dog posted was an owner surrender. A recent widower in his 40's surrendered his late wife's dog because "it was her dog & the dog didn't like him". The comments (over 50) started with a "that is so sad" and grew to all out hate for the man that lost his wife, going so far as to say "she is crying in heaven over his actions".
I know there is no way to keep people from commenting, but they can delete the comments. They are quick to take anything down that criticizes their group. So what do you think? Is there a need to post so much background on a dog's situation? Where is the line on letting commenters tear apart the character of a former owner?
*and just for the record, I find the story about the dog sad. Maybe the widower had other options, but I am willing to give someone who is facing a sudden tragedy a little more room in their actions.
@GeorgiaBear, Had I done that I think I would have put "death in the family" and left it at that. Still the crazy train conductor would insist the family should keep the dog. When I was at NHS they would post these horror stories of abuse by the previous owner to generate sympathy and to my glee, one day a former owner went to the newpaper and told his story. NHS sure got egg on it's face and had to make a public apology and admit they were " mistaken" I do see a problem in the use of facebook for dog postings. Often it gives a chance for question and answer, thus promotes adoption by informed people. However; sometimes it becomes a "bully pulpit" I saw a thread a while back on FOMAS where the dog came in as a stray and a reader recognized the dog and started dumping on the owner, then the owner went online and tossed in their two cents worth. Oreo called me and said go over there and take a look at what can go wrong with FB. The admin on that page pulled the controversial comment very quickly. there is something about the perceived anonymity online that can bring out the worst in people. It's the responsibility of the host to set the tone of the page.
I took a long time to say I agree with you, didn't I :) I get very few negative comments, I believe it's because I won't put them up and people have learned that. You can disagree, but no insults. Speak ;with the admin if you can and let them know that kind of rhetoric turns away adopters. All that needs to be said about any animal is the disposion of that animal, not going all the way back to it's last owners roots.
I think I may expand this into a post, thanks for the idea.
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